Comments on: Richard of St. Victor 5 – Evaluation of the argument thus far (JT)

By: Scott

Scott — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 01:38:07 +0000

I have yet to really study Aelred– you need to look at his book _Spiritual Friendship_; see

http://www.amazon.com/Spiritual-Friendship-Classic-Commentary-Classics/dp/0870612425/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1244770537&sr=1-1

I do know that this comes out of a monastery culture, and I do know that Cicero’s _On Friendship_ had a big influence on Aelred.
In fact, I hope to read through Aelred’s little book soon, so maybe this will help sort Richard of St. Victor’s ambiguities.

By: Palamas

Palamas — Thu, 11 Jun 2009 22:06:12 +0000

So . . . what does Cicero/Aelred have to say about love/charity? And where do they say it?

By: Scott

Scott — Thu, 11 Jun 2009 15:31:06 +0000

Yep– Aelred of Rievaulx (1110=1167) is in the background, I should think. Aelred borrows from Cicero. (And, of course, Henry of Ghent in the later 13th c. borrows from Cicero too when he discusses in what way friendship is a virtue).

By: JT Paasch

JT Paasch — Thu, 11 Jun 2009 14:16:41 +0000

‘First, scripture seems to teach that perfection actually lies in loving someone of lesser value – or at least loving those who may not be so easy to love (Mt 5:46-48 “The Sermon on the Mount” and Ps. 8:4-5).’

Yeah, I wonder exactly what Richard means by ‘charity’, for I could easily think that it means something like what Palamas is suggesting here. All the meanings I’ve thought ‘charity’ might have leave Richard’s argument less than persuasive. Helping the homeless? Loving the stubborn? Acting mercifully towards the needy? Etc.

Perhaps someone could enlighten me on what Richard has in mind by ‘charity’. I’ve heard that there are important Stoic ideas in the background here (e.g., Cicero’s De Amicitia), but I have no idea if that’s right.

By: Palamas

Palamas — Mon, 08 Jun 2009 15:45:51 +0000

I see at least two problems with Rick’s premise that true charity must be directed at another of equal worth, i.e., (T6).

First, scripture seems to teach that perfection actually lies in loving someone of lesser value – or at least loving those who may not be so easy to love (Mt 5:46-48 “The Sermon on the Mount” and Ps. 8:4-5).

And, second, scripture also seems to teach that we are of equal worth to God (Gen 1:26-27; Gen 9:6). How many sermons have you heard preaching that because we are made in the image of God we are of infinite worth?

Now, I understand that Rick was trying to prove his thesis apart from scripture; however, his conclusions should at least be consistent with scripture, right?